Salary Study: Taxpayers not yet out of woods
Jul 01, 2012 | 3241 views | 39 39 comments | 7 7 recommendations | email to a friend | print
THE COBB BOARD OF COMMISSIONERS made the right choice for taxpayers when it chose at Tuesday’s work session to override the desires of Chairman Tim Lee and County Manager David Hankerson and forego (for now) a $350,000 pay study to look at compensation for county employees.

That question will now be taken up by compensation and audit committees, as recommended by the commission’s hand-picked Citizens Oversight Committee.

The two new five-person committees would each consist of the chairman; a district commissioner who would rotate yearly; another elected county official; and two citizens with expertise in the field in question.

***
BUT TAXPAYERS are not yet out of the woods. The new committees could still recommend the county go forward with the expensive pay study. Such a study has been a priority with Lee.

“We need to find where the (compensation) market is now,” he said in May. “It’s changed considerably over the last couple years.”

And as we noted on this page at that time, there’s no question that market conditions have changed: They’ve gotten worse, with many Cobb residents hard-pressed to pay their property taxes (especially in the wake of the tax hike Lee’s board approved last year) and with many county residents out of work.

Moreover, many Cobb residents have figured out that the kind of salary studies that Lee and Hankerson want are typically used to justify higher salaries for government workers, who usually have better pay and benefits than the private sector to start with.

It’s true that Cobb has been operating under austerity budgets for the past several years, and that compensation for county workers has essentially been locked in place.

Well, guess what? That’s true as well for the private sector, which foots the bill for the public sector.

Members of the new committees created by the commission should keep that foremost in mind as they go about their business, and say “no” to any effort by Lee, Hankerson or others to foist the $350,000 salary study on them.
Comments
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cobber43
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July 09, 2012
I think they are funny also but most are sadly misinformed. Your county salaries and benifits are public record and you should check them before commenting. I think you would find you get a bargain for what we are paying.

Love how Ott is always talking cut and trim and how the corporate world is cutting but in case you missed it, he just walked a pickett line and voted hinself a 13% pay raise in the corporate world. For his Delta salary he should be smiling while flying.
Venter
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July 09, 2012
If Cobb isn't competetive with pay and benefits, the good employees WILL leave, ask the PD. We will only attract the otherwise unemployable and will be on the fast track to Fulton or Dekalb county status.
Kennesaw Voter
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July 10, 2012
When Cobb raises our property tax and refuses to cut employees...That is what makes us more and more like Fulton and Dekalb Counties...Those counties make me so THANKFUL I don't live in them with all those corrupt politicians. We have a few bad apples in Cobb...like Tim Lee to name just one....

My Cobb just keeps morphing into a Fulton and Dekalb image...very sad for those of us who own property here...all those renters...they really could not care less.
Kennesaw Voter
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July 06, 2012
Some of you commenters are funny...I am not an angry person...far from it...but I do stand for efficient government...not bloated government with over paid employees who learn how to milk the system. Yup, most of you don't like it when an informed taxpayer shines the light on you and your ill gotten gains.
The Instigator
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July 06, 2012
It lives!!!! I just love it when I'm right.
Kennesaw Voter
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July 05, 2012
To have county employees in charge of pay and benefits is very much like having...

The FOX guarding the hen house...

The hens who lay the eggs and actually make a difference....don't have a chance against the greedy county employees I mean fox
The Instigator
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July 05, 2012
Hey KV, You are wrong on all counts, regardless of the topic. Bet you just gotta have the last word as you seem to have so much time on your hands. Time's a wastin'. There is just no way you can prove me wrong. We can all just see you sitting there, seething (about anything and everything) your anger just boiling over and about to blow a gasket. Go ahead, start typing. You know you have to. Maybe this will push you over the edge. We need to reelect Time Lee. Will that do it?
anonymous
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July 06, 2012
Thank you, Instigator. The endless repetition of KV's name here forced most of us to ignore the train wreck and move on, regardless of any inane point the writer claimed in their own small mind to make. Silenced? One would hope so for now. But the monster lies beneath ready to strike at any minute.
To Facts Please
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July 05, 2012
If you can't live within your means, you certainly shouldn't be working for Cobb County. There's potential for all sorts of corruption there and it also demonstrates a lack of restraint, and, therefore, you probably don't show restraint in the use of our resources. Also, if you're not competent enough to find a job that pays what you want(expenses or not), you shouldn't be working for us. Obviously, you're not as fantastic as you think you are. It's unfortunate we have so many Cobb County workers who are whining. We deserve better. Let's purge our government completely of these people. There are plenty of energetic, very well-qualified people who could do these jobs better. David Hankerson, what kind of people are you hiring! I would be glad to help pay for a professional to weed out and fire these people.
Kennesaw Voter
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July 05, 2012
It is a lot of Baloney when Cobb County leaders claim that Cobb employees don't get paid enough. Cobb County employees make too much right now no matter how they compare to "other counties" and the civilian sector. Each county uses the other as a way to push pay and benefits up, up and up some more. Don't believe it? Well, one of the first things out of every county's so called leaders is, "when we compare our pay and benefits to other similar counties, we are below the average" ... then they push through a pay raise and then the next year other counties hold our county up as paying more than theirs...and on it rolls....yeah, we are smart enough to figure it out.

If Cobb County pay and benefits is so bad, why are they bombarded with applications??

If Cobb County pay and benefits is so bad, why are you still working there??

I was at one of the county offices last week and watched a front counter person reading what looked to be her personal yahoo email while she was supposed to be "working". Yes, they had me stand behind her work area while waiting and I gazed over at her work area to see how "busy" she was and could not help but notice. I am sure there are times when this person is swamped with work but based on my personal observation, she seemed to have a leisurely work day.

Cobb County has too many employees; cut the number and keep the pay scale FROZEN for another 2 years.
Myth vs. Fact
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July 02, 2012
Myth: Government workers usually have better pay and benefits than the private sector.

Fact: According to the Burueau of Labor Statistics and the Economic Policy Institute, government workers actually have LOWER pay and benefits than the their counterparts in the private sector.

Once again, we can't get to the point where we can debate opinions because, sadly, we're too busy arguing about inarguable facts.
OhMyPoorLittleSalary
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July 03, 2012
Maybe in 2006 this was true, but not today. If it is factual provide a link. I know very few private businesses pay 90% of a workers health premiums like Cobb County does. Clerical/Administrative make to $2 to $4 per hour less in the private sector than they pay at Cobb. Why when an Admin I job comes open does Cobb get 400 applicants in less than two weeks?
Myth vs. Fact
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July 03, 2012
I would love to provide links. Unfortunately, links to outside websites are not allowed in this comments section (see the terms of services at the bottom of the page).

The organizations I referenced provided recent information, and their reports can be found by anybody the same way that I found them...with your favorite search engine.
Kennesaw Voter
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July 05, 2012
Baloney, Cobb County employees make too much right now no matter how they compare to "other counties" and the civilian sector. Each county uses the other as a way to push pay and benefits up, up and up some more. Don't believe it? Well, one of the first things out of every county's so called leaders is, "when we compare our pay and benefits to other similar counties, we are below the average" ... then they push through a pay raise and then the next year other counties hold our county up as paying more than theirs...and on it rolls....yeah, we are smart enough to figure it out.

If Cobb County pay and benefits is so bad, why are they bombarded with applications??

If Cobb County pay and benefits is so bad, why are you still working there??

I was at one of the county offices last week and watched a front counter person reading what looked to be her personal yahoo email while she was supposed to be "working". Yes, they had me stand behind her work area while waiting and I gazed over at her work area to see how "busy" she was and could not help but notice. I am sure there are times when this person is swamped with work but based on my personal observation, she seemed to have a leisurely work day.

Cobb County has too many employees; cut the number and keep the pay scale FROZEN for another 2 years.
Alt Assessment
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July 02, 2012
Based on the comments from city/county employees, the pay and benefits are just awful. Why are you still there?
Facts Please
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July 02, 2012
I cannot speak for others, but I am here because I love my job, and I feel good knowing I am performing a public service. I would think you would prefer to have someone like me working in your government rather than some hack who could not get a job anywhere else (I was in the private sector for almost twenty years and could have stayed there and made a lot more money).

I never expected to get rich working for Cobb County, but I have bills to pay just like everyone else. All I ask is to be treated fairly.
Kennesaw Voter
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July 02, 2012
RIGHT ON THE MONEY - This article is 100% correct and echos what I have been saying for years...but it says it so much more eloquently than I ever could...hopefully, Tim Lee gets the boot and our new Chairman wont play these type games with us taxpayers.
Lacey T.
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July 02, 2012
Weren't you one of the angry and hate-filled voters who gave us Angelucci on the school board? Just wondering as you sound an awful lot like some of her supporters did then. If so - thanks for proving how wrong you are and for showing us that anything must be taken with a grain of salt if it comes from someone with so much pent up anger. Let me guess - you are not a supporter of the recent Supreme Court decisions and tarring and feathering is not just something you read about in the history books.
Kennesaw Voter
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July 05, 2012
@Lacey T.

SHAME ON YOU, if you were a supporter of that dog sledder dude who was not paying his taxes and ripping off Cobb County with his "homestead exemption" while also claiming to be a resident of Alaska and getting that state's bennies...people like you and that Alaskan dude are out to get over on the system any way you can. THANK GOD that Alaskan dude did not win, THANK GOD the MDJ exposed him for the crook he was...and THANK GOD Cobb voters were paying attention....yeah, Lacey, I definitely wanted Angelucci over that dude...24/7 - 365 days a year and still do.

Reply to OKPeople
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July 02, 2012
Pay is pitiful if you're unemployed; those checks are nothing compared to your salary. And for a lot of those who were working elsewhere, you made a lot more porportionately. And you had and probably still have great benefits, including retirement and health insurance -- paid for us taxpayers; some of us don't have retirement, health insurance or any other benefits. Stop complaining -- if you didn't like that job, you should have given it up so some of us more qualified, greatful people could have had it. You worked for the government (us taxpayers) -- what did you expect to make. Ungrateful Whiner!
SouthernGal
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July 03, 2012
I have no retirement benefit through my company...I pay for my health insurance and my salary is about the same as my sister who works for the county.

I cannot rollover vacation or sick time.
okpeople
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July 02, 2012
Former Cobb employee here, the pay is pitiful if you are among the rank and file.
Axeman_3
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July 02, 2012
I am not sure who wrote this but they are sorely misinformed on a major point when he/she says...

"who usually have better pay and benefits than the private sector to start with." This is absolutley not correct...I have worked for both the private and public sector and the fact is that the private sector almost always has a higher pay scale than the public sector. As a matter of fact it is difficult many times to attract people from the private sector to work for governmnet as they are generally not willing to take the pay cut associated. If you don't know the facts please keep your opinoins to yourself. As Mark Twain said...it is better to appear an idiot than to open your mouth and remove all doubt...
RedBoard
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July 02, 2012
You obviously haven't worked in the public (non-teaching, non-public safety) sector recently, Axeman3.

Government functionaries, particularly at the federal level now enjoy 20 % better pay and benefits that identical management level jobs in the private sector. Take a look at the booming housing market in the D.C. region. They have plenty of money up there, thanks to bloated, non-productive government jobs.

Most people asked to come to public sector jobs from private jobs won't...because they don't want to be in boring, dead-end, super-constrained, politically correct jobs, producing nothing.

Now, as for teachers and public safety employees, cut the staff of "administrators" at Glover Street in half (as a start) and use the savings to boost teacher pay by 25%. Public safety employees should get the same increase -- paid for by cutting 50% of the jobs at the worthless Cobb DOT and a variety of other unnecessary government departments. Hankerson's $250,000 salary needs a pretty serious haircut as well. That level is absurd for a man of this ability and character.
SG68
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July 02, 2012
@ Redboard

I agree with everything in your comment except your last statement.

Hankerson has minimal ability and even less character character.

Take a "0" off the salary you mentioned and that would be just about right.
Kennesaw Voter
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July 02, 2012
Dude you speak just like a county employee...we see who you are and we also see your selfish money grabbing motivation...stop abusing us TAXpayers
Vote Them Out
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July 01, 2012
Let's be sure we vote out whoever proposed and promoted this unnecessary expense on the taxpayers.
Facts Please
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July 01, 2012
And the factual basis for your statement that government workers get higher pay and benefits than their peers in the private sector is . . .?

Are you referring to the federal workforce? You may be correct if that is the case, but the topic is Cobb County government employee compensation,not federal employee compensation.

I and several others in my department work for Cobb County in a field which has direct counterparts in the private sector. I know for a fact thay our pay and benefits are substantially below those of our private sector peers because we have discussed this issue with them and have reviewed a national study comparing compensation with our peers across the United States and in Marietta and Cobb County.

Please stop perpetuating the overpaid Cobb County worker myth which seems to sell newspapers but fails to inform the citizens of the facts.

I have followed these blogs for over one year, and although your paper and some of your readers have argued numerous times that Cobb County employees are overpaid, I have not seen one shred of evidence which supports this contention.

As someone who tries to give the taxpayers (I am one too) an honest day's work for an honest day's pay, I do not want to be overpaid, but I do want to receive market based compensation, just like you and your readers do. Am I not entitled to that?
Kennesaw Voter
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July 02, 2012
Got news for you Mr. Greedy, County jobs are not suppose to be equal in pay and benefits to the private sector...they should pay a lot less but our idiotic politicians keep short changing us taxpayers in order to pander to you folks...if you dont like ur pay...LEAVE ...go work in the private sector...oh, that's right...they wont hire you.
Francine Pettibone
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July 02, 2012
I guess Kennesaw Voter told you. Nothing like complete anger and ignorance to end a conversation. I am not a Cobb County employee but would be very interested in seing some of the statisitics that the bloggers and editors foist upon us regarding your pay. What's the old saying - keep repeating a lie often enough and it becomes the truth? They need to back it up or shut up.
Facts Please
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July 02, 2012
Kennesaw Voter-it is not greedy to expect an honest day's pay for an honest day's work. I am not looking to get rich, I knew I would not make a lot of money when I took this job, but I do expect to be paid fairly. Your race to the bottom rhetoric indicates that you do not have any pride in your community and really do not understand anything about how government works.

You appear to want the worst possible people working in your local government which tells me you have never run a business (I did for almost twenty years). Most successful members of the private sector understand the importance of having a professional, hard-working, lean government work force. This actually assists the private sector. For example, do you want a minimally trained building inspector signing off on your permits when he is likely to make mistakes which could delay the opening of your business by a month when you are borrowing money form the bank?

Think about it, you just might be cutting off your nose to spite your face. Again, we are not asking for exhorbitant compensation, just something close to market rate for market work.

Kennesaw Voter
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July 05, 2012
@Facts Please - you do a good job of making my argument for me...your greed is quite clear when you demand a pay raise when most people have seen their net worth crash and many have lost jobs or their pay got cut. You are very lucky I am not running things because I would make some deep cuts and you could very well find yourself unemployed due to efficientcy increases. BTW, who decides what is comparable work in the private sector...governement by its very nature is doing work and services that the private sector does not do. As a government employee just remember that government (and therefore you) do make a profit; most departments are fat. They do their best to make sure they justify their existance even when they know they are wasteful because to do otherwise would more than likely eliminate their job or functions. Cobb has been growing its government size ever since I got here 25 years ago. Cobb does not really care about efficientcy...they care about growing their governmental foot print...it wont take long before Cobb will look (and act) like Dekalb and Fulton counties...2 of the most bloated taxpayer abusing counties in the entire country. After you read this, please go back to work and try to actually make a difference.
SG68
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July 01, 2012
Pay and benefits for any employee should not be equal to or more than the people they work for.

Public sector or private sector.

Period.
MyPoorLittleSalary
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July 01, 2012
Based on private market conditions for employee pay, Cobb employee's in general may be compensated above similar job classification in the private sector. For that matter all 'not-for-profit' entities have been somewhat insulated from market forces driving down labor costs. We chose a career path that was generally considered to be secure and before the financial crisis were paid much less than the private sector. Now eroding private sector pay is motivating taxpayers and their reps to reduce pay and pension benefits from governmental labor forces.
Axeman_3
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July 02, 2012
Cobb employees in general ARE NOT "compensated above similar job classifications in the private sector"...you are entitled to your own opinions but not your own facts...
Confused about Hanke
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July 01, 2012
Your article implies the decisions regarding pay rates will fall to an unelected and unaccountable oversight board. To hire Mr. Hankerson to be the county manager and then go against his management plan seems like a slap in the face. Hankerson could make a much higher salary in the private sector. Why he sits there and gets kicked in the gut by Bob Ott makes me wonder why he doesn't retire from Cobb County. The board hired Hankerson, they should be bound by his decisions.
Pitch Fork 3
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July 02, 2012
Hankerson wouldn't last a week in a high-level, private sector job. He'd be cut to shreds by people much, much smarter than he is, as well as ethically exposed once his "sovereign immunity" was removed.

If he could actually get more in the private sector, don't you think he would have jumped ship by now? But he hasn't, cause he's got it way, way too good living off of our backs, doing nothing but spending out money.

When will you people realize our government is not here to serve us....they are now only here to serve themselves bigger servings of our money. Geez.
dustoff
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July 04, 2012
Hankerson is an over paid, arrogant, and abusive manager that was put in the position by Bill Byrne, when he should have been run off.

And look at the record of Judy Skeel, his assistant, who was run off from Solid Waste, screwed up royally at CDOT and low and behold she got a cushy job as Hankerson's assistant.

Get a list of all county employees and their salaries and you will see where the big bucks go, yep right to the ones that the County does not rally need. But a guy who is a crew worker that has to get down in the sewers starts out at about $8.50 an hour.

Its public record but Tony Hagler will make you do an open records request to get it. And they will not tell you how many employees are in any position/pay grade.
uninformed5
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July 01, 2012
To make a statement that government workers usually have better pay than the private sector is ridiculous. They may have better benefits but absolutely not better pay. As a matter of fact that is why the benefits are generally better due to the low pay. I'm sure you can find instances where a government worker makes more than a private sector worker but as a whole government workers pay is less than the private sector. This has been known for many years through many studies. I understand that newspapers try to sell papers by stirring up controversies but I think it is bad journalism to report such a blatant lie. Why am I not surprised?
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